Recharging spheres Tecnosir

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John SS
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Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by John SS » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:54 am

Having read of the terrific improvements in ride quality members have achieved, I am planning to regas my spheres in the coming winter (also fitting adjustable shocks). Does anybody have any experience of the Tecnosir Citroen system which, with suitably sized inserts TIG welded on to the spheres, looks like it should do the job?
http://www.tecnosirstore.com/recharging ... -c720.html

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:55 pm

However this can be quite costly and I have seen prices of £300-400 +pounds for the 4 units plus fitting,this can involve welding a boss to the canister and great care must be taken to prevent heat damage to the internal rubber diaphragm . For those devotees wishing to keep the hydragas and the car as it came out of the factory then this is the route to take..as an alternative to the current prices for this I am working on producing a valve that can be quickly inserted by a competent mechanic/engineer and then be re-charged at a service centre with nitrogen facilities. This will bring down the cost from £350/£400+ to approx £100 and there will be no need to remove the units to undertake this work nor the risk of heat damage or DIY welding..it is my opinion that strict welding procedures undertaken by trained coded welders should be employed due to the high pressures involved. So far I have seen little evidence of this or any protection offered in the form of product liability insurance so buyer beware!
http://www.mikesatur.co.uk/index.php?ro ... uct_id=833

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by John SS » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:42 pm

However this can be quite costly and I have seen prices of £300-400 +pounds for the 4 units plus fitting,this can involve welding a boss to the canister and great care must be taken to prevent heat damage to the internal rubber diaphragm . For those devotees wishing to keep the hydragas and the car as it came out of the factory then this is the route to take..as an alternative to the current prices for this I am working on producing a valve that can be quickly inserted by a competent mechanic/engineer and then be re-charged at a service centre with nitrogen facilities. This will bring down the cost from £350/£400+ to approx £100 and there will be no need to remove the units to undertake this work nor the risk of heat damage or DIY welding..it is my opinion that strict welding procedures undertaken by trained coded welders should be employed due to the high pressures involved. So far I have seen little evidence of this or any protection offered in the form of product liability insurance so buyer beware!
Really interesting, thanks for this. Will be interesting to see what Mike comes up with.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Bigfootmgf » Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:42 am

Hi I have had mine done by Ian Kennedy and he is a fully qualified pressure vessel welder.
He takes great care as to not damage the membranes inside, he tests & checks for leaks so as far as I can see it was the only option
Paul

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:19 pm

Bigfootmgf wrote:Hi I have had mine done by Ian Kennedy and he is a fully qualified pressure vessel welder.
He takes great care as to not damage the membranes inside, he tests & checks for leaks so as far as I can see it was the only option
* Comment Deleted *

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Bigfootmgf » Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:19 pm

Sorry but I haven't seen any of what your saying !
But he did show me how he did it and the workmanship looked good to me.
I don't know of any others doing this kind of thing? I just wanted to keep my car on the road at the end of the day
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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:18 pm

Bigfootmgf wrote:Sorry but I haven't seen any of what your saying !
But he did show me how he did it and the workmanship looked good to me.
I don't know of any others doing this kind of thing? I just wanted to keep my car on the road at the end of the day
* Comment Deleted *

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Bigfootmgf » Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:12 am

Oh okay it will be interesting to see what he comes up with hopefully I shouldn't need it for a bit
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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Rob Bell » Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:00 am

This is a challenging problem: I've read that some have had problems with their welded bosses or Schrader valves that requires the system to be re-gassed with nitrogen every year. IMO that is not a good solution. Moulton Dunlop managed a solution that lasts over 20 years!

There's a company in New Zealand that has worked out how to recharge the sphere and replaces the gas-tight rivet - which to me seems like an ideal solution that looks factory.

I don't know what Mike's solution is going to be (a pressed in valve replacing the original fill rivet perhaps?)

But mine certainly need replacing, and a high-quality TIG welded boss and good quality high-pressure valves are essential. I'd certainly be interested to hear your long-term experience with Ian's work Paul :) :thumbsu:

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:11 pm

Rob Bell wrote:This is a challenging problem: I've read that some have had problems with their welded bosses or Schrader valves that requires the system to be re-gassed with nitrogen every year. IMO that is not a good solution. Moulton Dunlop managed a solution that lasts over 20 years!
I've read similar, but as far as I could see the person who first raised the problem eventually concluded that there was no pressure loss, just different ambient conditions.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by John SS » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:17 pm

Rob Bell wrote:I don't know what Mike's solution is going to be (a pressed in valve replacing the original fill rivet perhaps
I had an email from Mike at the weekend with the following info;

I'm having a meeting with my machinist in the morning and we shall see how long it is likely to take..perhaps 1-2 weeks. I have done some costings and we believe we can supply a set of 4 for £70 plus or minus a few £££ The spheres can be temporarily recharged with air to enable it to be driven to a nitrogen supplier.I would think the cost would be £40-60 at the most.The main saving is the cost for stripping out and refitting these units.. Around £120-150 ..which won't be necessary and the excessive charges for re-gassing £350 ish so there will be a saving of around £300+.
Regards
Mike

Certainly looks like a really interesting option especially as it avoids having to remove the spheres.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Bigfootmgf » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:24 pm

Still early days with mine Rob but it okay at the moment! The ride takes me back to what it was like when I first bought the car just love it! :thumbsu:
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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Rob Bell » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:54 pm

Where's Ian based? I might drop him a line. I'd be happy to supply the hydragas spheres to be modified and re-charged :)

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Rob Bell » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:55 pm

John SS wrote:
Rob Bell wrote:I don't know what Mike's solution is going to be (a pressed in valve replacing the original fill rivet perhaps
I had an email from Mike at the weekend with the following info;

I'm having a meeting with my machinist in the morning and we shall see how long it is likely to take..perhaps 1-2 weeks. I have done some costings and we believe we can supply a set of 4 for £70 plus or minus a few £££ The spheres can be temporarily recharged with air to enable it to be driven to a nitrogen supplier.I would think the cost would be £40-60 at the most.The main saving is the cost for stripping out and refitting these units.. Around £120-150 ..which won't be necessary and the excessive charges for re-gassing £350 ish so there will be a saving of around £300+.
Regards
Mike

Certainly looks like a really interesting option especially as it avoids having to remove the spheres.
It'll be interesting to see what Mike comes up with! :) :thumbsu:

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:02 pm

What's the gas volume in the spheres? Seems like what you want is a pressure vessel the same size with 800psi nitrogen inside it. Simply connect the two and allow pressure to equalise. Much easier than trying to take the car somewhere to be pumped up.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by jaapaap1111 » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:24 pm

I am confused: does mike come up with a regassing solution or does he, like stated on his website, come up with alternative springs and dampers?

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-G920F met Tapatalk

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by Reckless Rat » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:36 pm

Ian Kennedy is based in Telford.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by ZSx » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:07 pm

jaapaap1111 wrote:I am confused: does mike come up with a regassing solution or does he, like stated on his website, come up with alternative springs and dampers?

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-G920F met Tapatalk
Both?

Although when I asked him he said coil conversion...

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by BodgeItAndScarper » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:48 pm

jaapaap1111 wrote:I am confused: does mike come up with a regassing solution or does he, like stated on his website, come up with alternative springs and dampers?
If you have a look at the link I posted above, it's mainly about a coil-spring conversion.

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Re: Recharging spheres Tecnosir

Post by John SS » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:12 am

jaapaap1111 wrote:I am confused: does mike come up with a regassing solution or does he, like stated on his website, come up with alternative springs and dampers?

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He will have both a coil spring conversion and a regassing kit.

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